SPARTANBURG Young players in the NFL talk about it all the time.

Charles Godfrey, the Carolina Panthers' rookie safety, has said how much he's learning from the team's veteran defensive backs during this training camp.

Panthers receiver Dwayne Jarrett, in his second season in the league, is getting lots of help from older players like Muhsin Muhammad and Steve Smith.

Must be nice, fullback Brad Hoover is probably thinking.

Hoover, in the midst of his ninth training camp with the Panthers, came up the hard way. In an NFL world where being mentally prepared is as important as the physical side, he was on his own.

“When I first started, there weren't any veteran guys to really help me out,” said Hoover, who's eighth on the team's all-time rushing list (891 yards). “I didn't really understand the concept of (blocking) angles and I didn't really have anyone to show me how to play the position.”

Hoover was signed by Carolina as an undrafted free agent out of Western Carolina in 2000. He became an unrestricted free agent after last season, but re-signed with the Panthers – the only team he's ever played for – in February.

“Brad's the kind of guy you try to surround yourself with,” said coach John Fox. “He's your kind of guy. In the landscape of this league, with free agency, you can't blame a guy for trying to better himself (financially). We're fortunate to have him back.”

But it hasn't come easily. After gaining 290 yards as a rookie tailback, Hoover was switched to fullback in 2001. Incumbent Chris Hetherington was in his final season with the Panthers and Nick Goings had only just been signed as a rookie free agent.

“When I started (playing fullback), I was awful at it,” said Hoover. “But I knew that when I made the transition, that was the way for me to stay in the league.”

How did he learn the craft of playing fullback, a position that requires more blocking ability than running skills?

Mostly by watching film of other fullbacks around the league. Hoover studied how players like Seattle's Max Strong and San Francisco's Fred Beasley played, specifically how they blocked.

“I saw what they did that was successful and thought, ‘I can use this in my game,'” Hoover said. “Week in and week out, I watched their styles, how they played. I didn't have anybody telling me what to do. I was watching those guys. I'm more of a visual learner, anyway. So I learned by trial and error.”

It's paid off. Hoover has even had times when he's been a game's star – his 117-yard, one-touchdown effort on Monday night against Green Bay as a tailback in his rookie season 2000 remains his biggest moment.

But it's the nitty-gritty work at fullback that's kept him around.

“My position isn't the most fun in this league,” he said. “But you don't have to kill guys. You use angles and leverage.”

And the hits have continued to come.

He remembers being smacked so hard during his rookie season that he crawled in pain to the sideline. Last season, after a game against Tennessee, Hoover found imprints of his shoulder pads on his skin when he removed his jersey.

“It's weird,” said Hoover, 31. “With older players, the more they've played, the wiser they've gotten. They know how to use their bodies and how not to use their bodies. They use a lot of technique.

“Whereas these young guys come in and pound, pound, pound, pound.”

Hoover has fended off challenges from lots of younger players who want his job. This year it's Troy Fleming, a third-year player who played 29 games with Tennessee.

“Troy is a very good player,” said Hoover. “He's a good athlete and I expect him to give me a run.”

And he can count on plenty of help from Brad Hoover.